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Forum Thread: Java

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osgood74 Java
Member 21st Jun, 2009 19:01
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User Since: 21st Jun, 2009
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Location: US
Secunia Online Scanner has told me that I do NOT have Java installed on my Vista computer. I spent all day yesterday trying to install it to no avail. I tried everything that I could Google up to do it. No such luck. I even disabled my ESET Smart Security Firewall which I was totally devastated to do. I had panic attacks all day from doing that I'll tell you.

Can somebody help me please? Also, do I really, really need it? I'm wondering why I don't already have it, strange indeed.

Thank you and appreciate any and tips on this problem. How do I get replies, by email? I don't know how this works - newbie here.

I have Vista Premium Home Edition 32 bit and you already know my security suite. Any other questions - fire away. I'm fresh out of ideas here and exhausted trying to resolve it on my own. Assuming that it really needs resolving which I'm not completely sure of. Java and Javascript it totally Greek to me. All things techie are, truly. I don't understand the nomenclature, just simple English, step by step - so shortcuts or techie acronyms. Strart from the premise that I know nothing (truth anyway), nada, nil, zilch.

I love Secunia. SECUNIA RULES!!! :-)

Again, thank you,

desperate dumb newbie

Maurice Joyce RE: Java
Handling Contributor 21st Jun, 2009 19:09
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Have a look in Control Panel - Can U see an grey icon with a lookalike steaming coffee cup with the word JAVA beneath it?

--
Maurice

Windows 7 SP1 64 Bit OS
HP Intel Pentium i7
IE 11 for Windows 7 SP1
16GB RAM
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osgood74 RE: Java
Member 21st Jun, 2009 19:26
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Yes, it is there and when I click on it to open, nothing.

Why would Secunia Online Scanner say that I don't have it on my computer?

I'm trying to do an Online Scan now and nothing at all is happening. No results. I'd really like to have a current scan to know my status. I don't care much for the FileHippo one at all. Egad.

Major Bummer :-(


Happy Father's day to all You Dad's out there. Hope you receive terrific gifts.
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wr RE: Java
Contributor 21st Jun, 2009 20:38
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The enclosed link may help you-when you go there Java tests your system to see if/what version is installed, if problems exists there are links for download/help, but be advised that their helpline has to be paid for, it's not free. http://java.com/en/download/help/testvm.xml

Good luck & regards, wr


--
HP Pavilion Slimline s3020n
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osgood74 RE: Java
Member 22nd Jun, 2009 02:39
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thanks for the link.

Still no luck. I find this all very strange.

I have the icon in my Control Panel yet Secunia Online Scanner tells me I don''t have Java. What to do?

I tried uninstalling and re-installing. That doesn't work. I keep spitting into the wind here.

Is it worth it I wonder. Does everyone need Java and Javascript?

What would the obvious reasons be for me not being able to get it? I did as instructed. Disabled the firewall. Deleted any and all traces of old Java as instructed.

I need help and/or a miracle. Any really smart eggheads/computer whizzes here?

Thanks again!
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Maurice Joyce RE: Java
Handling Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 08:12
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Last edited on 22nd Jun, 2009 08:13
OK - we will continue as before.
Firstly I am slightly confused. U have triggered the thread by saying U are using PSI yet U keep saying U are running OSI.

Despite being a newbie U should first update to PSI ADVANCED MODE. Not only will U benefit by having more of your PC scanned for insecurities but it will give U more information to relay to this Forum & a toolbox to help.

To install PSI go here:
http://secunia.com/vulnerability_scanning/
Once downloaded look at the top right hand corner for SIMPLE & ADVANCED.
Click ADVANCED - Simple should now be coloured blue. U may get a message about advanced users etc - ignore it - using the advanced mode is easy as U will find out.

U will also note a series of tabs on the Overview page.
Firstly, are the graphics showing? They should be green.
Secondly set up the settings tab. I advise U leave the top box empty & tick the bottom 2 boxes.
Thirdly check your Secunia profile is set up. If not, U can use the same details as OSI.
Now click the scan tab & run a full scan.

Study the scan results - is there any reference to JAVA in either the Insecure/End Of Life/Patched/Secure Browsing tabs?

--
Maurice

Windows 7 SP1 64 Bit OS
HP Intel Pentium i7
IE 11 for Windows 7 SP1
16GB RAM
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 10:58
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For Maurice ,
Just a point Maurice , I think if Java applets cannot be found OSI says so & will not run . This tends to be a browser problem with OSI .
PSI GUI used to have load problems if Java(script?) is not loaded on the PC.
Back to you on Mars.
Take care
Anthony

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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osgood74 RE: Java
Member 22nd Jun, 2009 18:05
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There you go Anthony! Right on the nail.

The applets on the Online Scanner DO NOT load. I get a prompt. I get a lot of "error" prompts about this whole Java business.


Funny that I have the Icon but Secunia says I don't have Java.

What is it and why must I have it and/or Javascript anyway? I wonder if I even have the latter since Secunia says I don't have the former.

(Again, I don't understand the gobbledygook online. Too technical.)

Thank you Maurice and Anthony. Very much. I'll download the link and report back.
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 19:31
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Last edited on 22nd Jun, 2009 19:41
You probably do have Java , but your browser won't let Secunia OSI "read" it if it's not "enabled" actually in the browser.
I'm sure Maurice can/will answer much better than I can ; but in the case of OSI we will need to know which browser you are using - IE or Firefox or Chrome or another - then he can tell you how to "enable" Java and Javascript.
I would suggest as a newbie , you would really benefit from having a friend help you understand the basics . I was lucky enough to have a good friend explain lots of things over the 'phone and used Google and forums to fill in gaps. He is/was very insistent on only telling me what I could use without getting into trouble - as in , if you don't understand , don't fiddle by yourself & most things are a logical consequence of your actions ; although they can be irreparable .
And of course , if it ain't broke , don't fix it .
After a couple of years or so I've become quite confident.
Download PSI &get back to us.

Take care
Anthony.

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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osgood74 RE: Java
Member 22nd Jun, 2009 21:38
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Thanks Anthony. You are very kind, sensitive and thoughtful. Lots of dummies like myself are all too often terrified to ask for help online lest we endure pompus and condencing types. Some pretty rude and mean ones too. I've surfed my way around kajillions and LORDY my eyeballs shot out of my head.

I really like and respect Secunia so I took a GIANT chance posting here. Just want to give you and others credit for the time, patience and help you've given me so far.

I still am having mucho big problems though in spite of it all. I'm just about ready to give up or put a cinder block through this dang computer.

I should've put all the crap I have and use in my profile.

I have Vista Premium Home Edition 32 bit
sp pack 2 (what ever that is)

I go back and forth between FF3 and IE8 - latest versions, natch, thanks to Secunia
.
Same with "Windows Mail" and Thunderbird.

For Security I have ESET Smart Security Suite latest version of v4. (Some of you may be familiar with their noted + well respected anti-spyware: Nod32)

I also use free versions of Threatfire, Sandboxie and a weekly scan from Super-Anitspyware (ONLY one I can find anywhere on the entire Internet that actually DOES find and delete "Tracking Cookies") and Malwarebytes. The latter one once found 3 "things" on a scan that somehow slipped through the highly touted Nod32 anti-spyware. So now I have the free version and run a weekly scan. Never finds anything anymore, thank goodness!

I have the paid version of AdvancedSystems Care Pro and run a weekly scan.

ESET wants me to chuck Sandboxie and Threatfire but trolling through various forums I have found many ESET users that use one or the other with no problem. Some both. For a long time as well. So, I'm confounded by that advice. I truly hate to give up my sandbox. Imagine opening up any email without one? I can't. Also, I've read all over the place that Threatfire works alongside all anti-spyware just fine and does NOT interfere with it. A huge conundrum indeed.

Still hoping for a miracle.

Maurice,

I'm having a little trouble trying to follow your link and instructions. Will keep trying though. Are you suggesting to chuck the Online Scanner and just go with the PSI - Advanced? I've never heard of Advanced PSI but I love nothing better than to learn new things.

Thank again all!


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Maurice Joyce RE: Java
Handling Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 21:58
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I just think u would be better off with PSI. It scans thousands of programmes whereas OSI is a few hundred.

By default this gives U are more detailed picture of your PC's security. It has the added advantage of a toolbox which helps with any investigation necessary to clear problems.

To prevent U getting different viewpoints & help U solve your problems more easily I will bail out of this thread & leave it to Anthony & WR.





--
Maurice

Windows 7 SP1 64 Bit OS
HP Intel Pentium i7
IE 11 for Windows 7 SP1
16GB RAM
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 22:01
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Last edited on 22nd Jun, 2009 22:06
Hi,
I don't have time just now to comment in detail but :-

1) I would consider Sandboxie as the absolute base to secure browsing - never mind what eset tell you .
2) you appear to have an excellent security base - remember to use it & itcan never be 100%

Most of what keeps me safe I learnt from Gizmo Richards , He's highly respected and "easy" to understand ; he's also a Sandboxie , Secunia & Eset (or rather NOD32)fan.
If you want to , try reading his secure browsing advice at this link:

http://www.techsupportalert.com/how-to-secure-your...

I would also pick one browser early and get used to it.
I'm a Firefox/Chrome man & Maurice is IE8.

I use XP & so am no use to you re Vista.

Take care
Anthony

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 22:04
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For Maurice,
Don't bail out you are needed (our posts just crossed) . I am not technical & know nothing about IE or Vista.
You are needed to keep an eye on us.
Anthony.

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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wr RE: Java
Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 22:05
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Maurice, don't bail out. You know you are my IT hero-besides I agree with you on installing PSI & running in the Advance mode. Stay tuned for more on this subject-it may take all of us to settle the problem. BTW we may need to call on puget 1 for help.

Regards, wr

--
HP Pavilion Slimline s3020n
Windows Vista Home Premium SP2 32 bit
AMD 64 Athlon X2
Firefox 24.4.0 ESR
The weakest link of a computer system is always sitting in front of the monitor.
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 22nd Jun, 2009 22:09
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Spot on wr.
Glad you're back from Mars , Maurice:))

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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osgood74 RE: Java
Member 23rd Jun, 2009 01:58
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Maurice,

Thank you very, very much. I just installed the PSI-Advanced. Ran a scan and came out 100% secure and up-to-date. Felt great.

Just for the heck of it I went to the Secunia online scanner website and hit "Start". Guess what? It still is telling me that I do NOT have Java. I'm back where I started with my very first post. Gack!

Heck, I must've installed it correctly 5 times this week and it shows up in my Control Panel for add/remove programs. That definetly does mean I absolutely do have it, correct?

It looks to me like this major conundrum is never going to be solved. I even shut off Threatfire to see if that would make a difference. It made no difference at all.

I cannot figure this out Secunia Corp. Could somebody from Secunia (I'm beyond desperate now) please tell me why this happens to some people? What are the usual reasons that cause Secunia to put up a prompt saying "this machine does not have Java installed" when it clearly does, PLEASE?

Again, thank you EVERYBODY.

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osgood74 RE: Java
Member 23rd Jun, 2009 04:04
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Anthony,

I really like that Gizmo site you gave me. I added it to my FAVORITES. The security article was excellent. You all have great tips and resources.

Feel free to keep them coming my way. I could use as many as I can get.

Thanks again all,

Osgood74
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 23rd Jun, 2009 09:24
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If you have PSI working , as you say , then using the on line scanner and/or trying to sort it is wasting your time - PSI is a lot more efficient and makes OSI unnecessary.
OSI "probably" won't work if Sandboxie is running.
To see if Java/Javascript is "enabled" in Firefox3.0.11 open/click the "tools" link in the bar at the top of Ff ; at the bottom of the menu click on "options". In the window that opens click on the "content" tab - make sure that Java & Javascript are ticked & thereby "enabled". {{Get to know your way round the other tabs in this window to help you control cookies and adverts which "pop-up ,etc . "Tracking cookies" are not actually that dangerous they just invade your privacy - I hate them.}} If OSI does not now run in Ff NOT sandboxed then you would seem to have a problem between Java & Vista on your PC. Secunia can't help and neither can I . Recheck Java etc with the link wr gave you.

Sandboxie can conflict with security stuff due to"driver" problems - if you don't have this problem , you are fine.(crosses finggruurs)
Threatfire conflicts with lots of security stuff - that's why they keep changing it - if ESET really don't like it , then think carefully about keeping TF -conflict is not always obvious , but can dramatically hit efficiency.

That's all from me.
I hope you are checking this for me , Maurice and wr.

Bonne Journée
Anthony.

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 23rd Jun, 2009 11:06
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For Mr.M.Joyce ,
You should know that I live in the largest vineyard in the world & have national & international influence - so unless you want you & the whole of Salisbury to run out of wine at critical times , you had better get your inestimable knowledge & skills back in here.
A word to the wise & all that.
Bonne Journée.
From Mr.A.Wells

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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wr RE: Java
Contributor 23rd Jun, 2009 17:11
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osgood 74 I agree 100% with Anthony Wells last post. Having said that I also agree w/Maurice Joyce earlier post asking where Secunia PSI is finding Java(tm)? If the PSI isn't finding it, it ain't there, therefore we need to know is it there or isn't it working? 2 entirely different problems. Forget scanning w/OSI & what it says-that's been established long ago & isn't paramount to the problem(s). @ this time the only other suggestion I have is this-open Control Panel there you will find Java(tm)control panel-in Vista classic view this is the "coffee cup" w/JAVA under it. Open & under the General tab midway of the window it says Network Setting & explains how Java(tm) connects to the internet. Open the Network Settings tab(it's the only choice)& make sure the radio button is set @ Use browser settings. There could be several conflicts as you mentioned. The one I would definitely research is Eset & Threatfire. I also use the Eset program-& if I remember correctly Wilders Security is the official forum for Eset. If Eset & the majority of that forum suggest not to use Threatfire i'd drop it like the Titanic. Sometimes too much of a good thing can cause problems. Anyhoo hope you get things worked out-don't lose faith-anything worth having is worth working for-if it all was easy would it really be worth it? To Maurice Joyce-hope you're sitting by & enjoying this-don't give up on Anthony Wells & myself-someday we might be ALMOST as good as you. Hope some of this info is helpful. Please post back & keep us up-to-date, that way we & others reading the Forum can stay informed about what works & what doesn't.

Regards, wr

--
HP Pavilion Slimline s3020n
Windows Vista Home Premium SP2 32 bit
AMD 64 Athlon X2
Firefox 24.4.0 ESR
The weakest link of a computer system is always sitting in front of the monitor.
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osgood74 RE: Java
Member 24th Jun, 2009 19:04
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Thank you again everybody.

I now have Java working on FF3. It's enabled under "plug-ins" as well as Javascript (whatever the heck that is). I mainly use FF & Tbird. They load up much quicker than IE8 which is very, very slow. No clue why it's 10 times slower than IE7 was. I hear it's much more secure so that is why I upgraded. Now I can't go back to IE7 - I tried in vain for 2 days. DRATS!!!

Speaking of IE8, I just download and installed today's updated PSI 1.5 and ran it expecting to get another clean 100% result report. Lo and behold, it told me everything IS patched but that "I have 1 Insecure Program - With NO SOLUTION". And that was IE8. Was I shocked to learn that after being told it was all this and that. Hmm.

Now if I ever use it at all it will only be when I open it with Sandboxie. That will really, really be S L O W, lol. ;-)


Thank goodness for Secunia. Keep's one right on top of things. I'm now subscribed to the weekly newsletter. Should I subscribe to the ADVISORIES? I don't know what those are or if I will even understand them.

I did take the advice to ditch Threatfire which was very hard for "totally insecure while online" me to do. I miss it already (like being fully armed, heh) but all of you know about such things plus ESET did tell me to ditch it also. I only know what I read online and what I read online lots of times was that it works WELL with ESET and all anti-spyware including ESET. Go figure.

I'm very familiar with Wilders ESET forum. That's just one of the many places I've trolled around in a lot.

Again, thanks for everything.

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wr RE: Java
Contributor 24th Jun, 2009 20:06
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Good to know you've gotten your problems solved. From all I've read online about IE8, yes there are 'holes' & M$ knows of them & someday will provide patch(s). M$, Java(tm), & Adobe to name a few always seem to drag their feet when insecurities are found. Anyway, glad you're @ 100% & hopefully can stay that way with Secunias PSI help. Happy cyber-surfing.

Regards, wr

--
HP Pavilion Slimline s3020n
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 24th Jun, 2009 20:46
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Last edited on 24th Jun, 2009 21:00
Glad to have your update.
As far as IE is concerned , I use a Ff "add on/extension" from Mozilla called "IE Tab" which lets me into IE required pages such as Microsoft or Windows update directly from Ff.
However,you also change your security/risks/threats to those of IE from those of Ff - so keep your Sandboxie running. The only exception I make is when downloading/patching from MS.

Using my friends "need to know" maxim , as regards TF you need to find out the difference between "behaviour blocking" and "signature blocking" and what "HIPS" is.

Here is a link to our friend Gizmo's section on the subject , which you might want to read (including the HIPS link in the intro) when you have time ;-

http://www.techsupportalert.com/best-free-hips.htm

My (like everbody else's top of the range, fully loaded , wins all prizes) software firewall includes a HIPS type process and it really hates TF and other similar programs.
Why not ask ESET what kind of behaviour blocker they have in their firewall - but wait until you understand what you're asking. If TF is like a loaded gun , you don't want it to go off by itself & shoot you in the foot ; or elsewhere for that matter. What seems to work , on a daily basis , may encounter difficulties when threats actually arise .

Finally , don't let your "paranoia" overcome your surfing fun - the bad guys are probably not after you ; unless you stick your head up with a bullseye between your eyes by telling them where you are and how much treasure you have stashed on your PC.

Once again , I hope MJ or wr will correct me where I'm wrong.

Take care & Bonne Soirée

Anthony

PS: Advisories are more complicated than my needs.
PPS: The best Ff add on ever is "Colourful Tabs" :-o))

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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osgood74 RE: HIPS
Member 24th Jun, 2009 21:32
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Copied this off of a Nod32 User's (the anti-spyware module of ESET's Suite) Guide:

"Host Intrusion Prevention System (HIPS)

Host Intrusion Prevention System (HIPS) protects your system from malware or any unwanted activity attempting to negatively affect the security of your computer. It utilizes advanced behavioral analysis coupled with the detection capabilities of network filter to monitor running processes, files and registry keys, actively blocking and preventing any such attempts."

Now since I do have HIPS in my security arsenal which is getting smaller, sob, that forever cancels out me reinstalling Threatfire, correct?

MyFF add-ons are:

WOT
BetterPrivacy 1.29
TACO 1.7 (cookie opt-out)
StumbleUpon

I'd add at least 2 dozen more but then it would take as long as (tagged TODAY as "insecure")IE8 to load up I am guessing, not sure about that.

I should have the security ones instead, correct? Which ones are the "absolutely must have" security add-ons that make Firefox Blow Away IE? Since I surf using Sandboxie there may or may not be some of them I don't require, I hope, correct?

Those will be my last questions and I'll disappear forever and leave you super-intelligent, gracious, generous, very kind, patient, extremely wonderful people alone and miss you as well.

Take Care + Be Well,

Osgood (forgive me my many typos pls - acute myopia coupled with a few catatacts)
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Anthony Wells RE: HIPS
Expert Contributor 24th Jun, 2009 21:57
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Last edited on 24th Jun, 2009 21:59
Hi Osgood ,

Nicest thing anybody said to me all day , unless you were actually referring to MJ & wr. We don't get older , we just get slower & that includes my multifocals & one finger typing.

I think that your security is just what you need , as is & you have set TF free to fly away (it used to be called CyberHawk) -just let it go !!

Addons & extensions will slow you down , but they can be fun ; test one for a few days & see how it runs.

I use "CoolPreviews" when I am doing "research" & find it invaluable.
I prefer to use Google Toolbar rather than the Ff standard & I use "LinkExtend" which includes WOT and other site advisers.
If you click the "view" tab at the top of Ff & click "toolbars" you can decide which toolbars show at the top of the screen.

That's all from me ; take care & have fun .

Anthony

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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osgood74 RE: Google Toolbar
Member 24th Jun, 2009 23:28
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I just went FF add-ons and got the Google Toolbar but it does NOT have WOT on it.

What did I do wrong? It was updated lest than a month ago.

The ExtendLink looks nice but that also looks like a utility if you have children to me for the most part. I just skimmed it.

I tried Cooliris a long time ago and liked it a lot. Also something called Interclue. Lot of fun.

I want my WOT back.

Anthony, I meant you as well as everyone here in this fantastic forum.

Don't forget to get your brand new 1.5 PSI's today everyone.
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Anthony Wells RE: Google Toolbar
Expert Contributor 24th Jun, 2009 23:42
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Last edited on 24th Jun, 2009 23:48
Keep WOT as you had it originally - reload it if necessary ; it's not in Google toolbar , which has other toys to add & subtract . You should find that you control WOT from the Ff "tools" tab menu .

LinkExtend combines the info from 8 site advisers , one of which is WOT ; the child safety is optional . There's no rush , try it sometime. It also has a fascinating IXQuick SuperSearch system - makes a change from Google , etc.

Don't forget "colourful tabs" & if you tire of stumbling checkout "Personas" - read the instructions.

Have fun.

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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osgood74 RE: Google Toolbar
Member 24th Jun, 2009 23:49
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did you install the google toolbar from the FF add-on site or from Google's site? Just wondering as one may be different from the other or more updated.

Thank you for your interesting tiips.


OK, bye bye
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Anthony Wells RE: Java
Expert Contributor 25th Jun, 2009 00:07
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I get mine from Google , but Mozilla has the same stable versions . I'm using a slightly later beta ; not that you would notice .

--


It always seems impossible until its done.
Nelson Mandela
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